From Fried to Focused: Burnout fixes for personal & business growth

In this episode of Not Nice, Clever, we're hitting pause on branding and marketing advice and getting real about burnout—the kind that sneaks up on you while you're busy being "fine." 

Kat opens up about her own burnout story (spoiler: it wasn't pretty) and we break down how to recognize the warning signs before you hit the wall.

Here's the thing: burnout doesn't mean you're weak or doing it wrong. It means you're human. And if you're a business owner, high performer, or someone who's been white-knuckling your way through life lately, this conversation is for you.

We're discussing why rest isn't optional (even when it feels impossible), and how to realign your life and work so you can actually sustain the success you're building.

This is every introverted entrepreneur's permission to stop glorifying exhaustion & gentle reminder that the people in your life need you healthy, not heroic. 

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• Not Nice Clever
• Candice Carcioppolo
• Kat Torre

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Transcript

 Burnout can be chronic, right? It can be very subversive where you're not realizing it's even happening consciously. Yeah. So I think another question to ask yourself and to gut check is do you even know why you're doing the things you're doing day to day if you are maybe not sleeping well, maybe sleeping a lot, if there's any type of resentment that you're having towards the work that you typically like, those are all signs that this might be burnout and you might want to get.

Serious about being proactive in this moment so that you don't lead down the spiral? That's the thing. 'cause if you can proactively notice throughout your day to day when you're doing things that drain your energy, you will ideally slow the draining of your battery. Know that we live in a day and age where you can probably find some sort of AI agent.

We're human being to do the task for you to 80% completion, and you can fix the other 20%, like at least that that's a win. Welcome back to Not Nice, clever. Today we're talking about burnout, the kind that doesn't just make you tired, but makes you question everything. Kat just had one of those moments and instead of hiding it, we wanted to bring it here because burnout isn't a sign of weakness.

It's a signal. A signal that something in your business, your brand or your life is out of alignment. And in this episode, we're pulling back the curtain on what burnout actually feels like, why it happens, and how to come back from it without burning your whole business to the ground. If you've ever hit that wall or if you're scared, you're heading toward it, this one's for you build in public, as they say.

Right? So we are sharing in public with the clever crew. What I have been going through, this is super timely. This was on our heart, and you guys know we always record only when we're feeling it. We had another topic picked out for this episode, but we're like, mm, no. What's, what's actually on our mind. So, yes.

What's actually going on right now? Yeah. What's going on? Right. So I'm just coming back from being sick for about 10 days and I'm not a great sick person according to Will. I think I'm, I'm okay. I think I'm okay. But, um, uh, well it did take me four days to go to the doctor, so there's that. Uh, and I really was reflecting a lot during this 'cause there's not really much you can do when you're sick and you're lying on the couch.

Contemplating all of your life decisions that led to this moment. And I'm gonna take some full ownership. And I, I'm very aware that when I got sick and when I like hit that wall, I definitely contributed to that situation. It wasn't just like, oh, I got exposed to somebody who was sick, or I had, I hadn't been traveling, I hadn't been traveling, hadn't been around anybody that was sick.

It's not really that cold here in Philly. And I just know, like I get sick every once in a while when I push myself too far. And that's exactly. It's exactly what happened, so, so here we are, but you are feeling better and things are changing. Um, yes. On your end, so that's great. What do you think, now that you're on the other side of it and you can have the space to reflect?

Yeah. What do you think are a few of the things that contributed to you getting to burnout? Because isn't it funny that it's something that we talk about all the time? Yeah. It's something that we warn people about. Yep. And yet we're both still susceptible to it at times. Yeah. We're, nobody is immune to the things that make you human, you know?

Right. Like I, I had said on another podcast, um, that like, imposter syndrome is a human thing. It's not just like, oh, only some people experience it. Right, right. Burnout's a human thing. Like don't, I don't care how big your brand is, how much money you have in your bank account, whatever it is, um, you are susceptible to burnout if you aren't paying attention.

And I think there were moments leading up to getting sick where I. I would be heading into a meeting or a client session and I would just feel like my body like kind of cave in on itself. Like I had nothing left to give. This is like trying to get blood from a stone, like there's nothing good that is coming of this situation.

And yet I still went to the meeting and I still delivered and or I still said yes to the thing. And I think another reflection I have is that you need to realize anytime you're saying yes, you are saying no to something else. It is binary. Like that. Mm-hmm. So what are you saying no to when you say yes, and are you okay with saying no to that?

Yeah. If you're not, don't say yes. I think that was a big one. You're saying no to yourself, but there's a reason that you felt like you had to continue to push through? Yeah. Ego thinking. Thinking that if I just got one more thing done, or if I just got that done, or, oh, that thing has been on my to-do list for months, like, let me just knock it out.

Or, oh, Will's working late and so I can work when he's not here. Or the idea that resting and rotting on the couch is not productive, but it is because rest has ROI and it's just all of these things of. Needing to work hard and to be busy in order to feel like I am contributing. Like I'm doing it, like I'm proving it, right?

Yes. But who the proving it am I proving it to? I think that's, that's a huge part. That's the answer you're looking for. Okay. Well, I mean, it's not the, I dunno if it's one that I was looking for, but I guess that's the one that I feel like I resonate with most is like proving that I am in this, proving that I'm dedicated, proving that I'm a hard worker, I'm showing up, I'm being consistent.

Right. And I think that's the thing. So I think also there's probably also some guilt associated with it. Like you don't wanna let anyone down so you Yeah. Don't show up, but kind of unexpectedly you can let people down. Yeah. If you're not taking care of yourself. Yeah. And like that physical like symptoms, you know, me feeling drained and me feeling like I had like nothing left to give.

I wasn't creative. I couldn't write. And I love to write. I've been doing, you remember when we had Anne Ley on? Yeah. Um, a couple months ago and she talked about the 90 day writing challenge. Yeah, I did that. I have been doing that, but I couldn't do it. I couldn't finish it. I got sick. Right. As I was about to finish, it was like day 88 or 89, and I, I couldn't even write one sentence, Candace.

Wow. And you guys know me. I can't shut up. I can't stop writing. Never. So if Kat can't write, something's wrong, you know? Yeah. Like something's off. I think the other big thing to look out for too is if you start to resent the things that used to like bring you joy. That's another thing I started noticing.

I was like, why am I upset that I have to do this? I'm like, I get to do this. I'm so excited. I create my life and my business and our partnership and the podcast and, and like, it's really cool what I get to do. Mm-hmm. But now I'm saying like, Ugh, I have to, and I'm like, whoa. I wanna talk a little bit more about this idea that some people might be listening and saying, okay, but you're just sick cat.

Like mm-hmm. What's the difference between. Being sick or just being tired in general. And then mm-hmm. Knowing that this is actually a burnout sesh for you, how do you know the difference? I mean, good question. I think getting sick for me was just a very dramatic expression of burning out, right? Mm-hmm.

Because if you are. Not excited and inspired. Um, you're either neutral or you're very easily negative and negative feelings and rumination and overthinking. It literally changes your body chemistry and it's so easy for you to fall into that trap of looking for the negative, comparing yourself thinking you're falling short, and the more negative you are, the more like.

Farther down, you drag yourself. Mm-hmm. And then if you're physically exhausted, like you get sick, yes. Maybe when you're exposed to something, but also when you have weakened yourself. Mm-hmm. Like I was weakening myself. I was doing it, and that's why it's like, damn. You know? But it's a good thing to realize that if you are experiencing burnout.

Likely you are contributing in some way, shape, or form. Obviously I don't have, you know, little kids, um, that I have to deal with or, or family that I, I take care of, like, and so I empathize with people in those situations or Candace, like, you know, your, your baby at home. Yeah. Other things can contribute to burnout, but know that in some way, shape, or form, you are also contributing to it.

So that then that means that you can also do something differently within your power to help. Yeah. You have the ability to make decisions that help you stay away from burnout. Yeah. So it can happen. It happens to the best of us, but it does. What are a few things that now looking back, you realize that you were doing, that you would do differently in the future?

So I think. Not micromanaging every aspect of my business and of my day to day. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Um, I'm looking at you or, or, or talking to you micromanagers and, and perfection. Recovering perfectionists, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Amazing community of recovering people, pleasers and recovering perfectionists here. And to notice when you're doing something, if that particular task or, or, or project gives you energy or takes away your energy.

Even if it's something as innocuous as creating a calendar invite, like, I dunno about you, Candace. I don't live to manage my calendar. I really don't. Oh my God. I, I just plate, she just rolled her eyes, guys, for you. Just like, well, I just got it off my plate because it's, my calendar is such a mess. It's full-time job.

So many things. Right? And like, how did I get six back-to-back meetings on this calendar? What did I do wrong? Right? Like, yeah. I. It was so bad that mm-hmm. I asked Chad to help me come up with some, some, I don't know, barriers that prevent some of that, but then I also just, yeah. Um, finally gave it to my assistant who I've had for three years, and I should have trusted her with it a long time ago.

But it was one of those things that I was, I felt like I had to do myself. I, I don't know why. Yeah. But, um, finally gave it to her last month and things are. Progress is being made. So it's nice to not being made. Think about that. And, and sometimes it's nice to just send her a voice note and say like, Hey, do this and I don't have to technically do it or stop whatever I'm doing to do it.

Right. And that has been amazing. So I love a good voice note. It's a little calendar aside. Yes. So that's, that's the thing. 'cause if you can proactively notice throughout your day to day when you're doing things that drain your energy, you will ideally, you know. Slow the, the draining of your battery before it gets to like low battery mode.

Like that was a, a joke that I had said after we got back from cell at 25 in Orlando. I'm on low battery mode, I'm on 11%, you know I'm on the yellow. Yeah, right. It is yellow. It is yellow flag right now. So just doing that in your day to day, notice what it is and know. Know that we live in a day and age where you can probably find some sort of AI agent or human being to do the task for you to 80% completion, and you can fix the other 20%.

Like at least that's, that's a win rather than you doing a hundred percent of it and then it like knocking down your internal battery 5% every single time you do that task. That just kills your vibe. Right. Yes. So look for the, it sounds like we're talking about looking for the mundane tasks that we are still gripping onto, even though we know someone else could do them.

Right. Which is really scary for. You sometimes if you're a new business owner because you feel nervous to make an investment. Yeah. But with AI now, there's so many opportunities to just figure out a program that can help you or you know, an AI assistant or mm-hmm. Some way that you can build systems that will allow.

You know, for better flow in your business. So it, when I first started with ai, like it gave me parameters to use in my Calendly mm-hmm. That were really helpful. So like, just small things, like I had to like click a box that said don't no more than three of these meetings per day. Okay. I love that. Cool.

Like, you know, like that's one of my favorite boxes. Right. So, um, just, and it goes by meeting type. Right. So maybe I'll take. 10 consultations a day, but I'm only taking three client sessions a day because Right. They're different energies. Right. Different energy exchange in those and prep required and Yes, exactly.

And so totally using AI to help me figure out how to use the tools I already have. Better. I think another reflection that I had this time around was that my burnout came from that overworking, right? The trying to do everything rather than trusting my team to support me. In the past, and this might be true for somebody listening in, I have been burnt out by the people around me because.

Our values were out of alignment. Mm-hmm. So that's another sneaky thing that can cause burnout. Right? Because your values are the operating code by which you make yes or no decisions. It's like the A CTG of your DNA. Your values are that for your decisions. Of course, you know, I have to throw in a science analogy at some point, and in the past I would be burnt out by people who didn't align with my values because they would say something, they would be like, or I would ask them a question, right?

I'd be really excited about something. And then they would say, well, that's never gonna work. And I would just be like, Ugh, come on, Sandra. Like, why are you killing my vibe? Like, why say that? Why? And then I realized you guys, oh, I value personal growth and creativity. That's why I think, Ooh, let's find the solution.

Let's figure it out. How can we do it? Who do we know that can help us? Right. Sandra did not value personal growth creativity. I'm sorry for all the Sandras in the audience right now. It don't take it personally, it's not you. I'm sure your values align with us because you're a part of the clever crew. So this is not you, Sandra.

I just, I'm tired of people saying Karen. 'cause that was my aunt's name and I loved my aunt very much and I'm like, it's rebrand. The name Karen. Sorry, Sandra. Um, so I, I don't know, like Candace, have you ever felt burnt out by people? Definitely like where they just say something and you're like, Ugh. You know, I've definitely felt burnt out in a work environment before when I was no longer aligned with the mission.

And that's a big one too. Yeah. And I did not have the same like, I don't know, value for. This sounds terrible, but like, I don't think I have to work all day long, like hard work. Like I don't, I do hard work, hard work or effective work, but not for 24 hours a day. 'cause yeah, I, I work hard so I can live well, right?

Mm-hmm. And I don't, so I don't subscribe to that when some people wear that as a badge of honor that they, you know, worked for 14 hours a day. Like that sounds terrible to me. Yeah. And I do. Recognize that there were periods in my life when I had to do that, this to ramp up to a certain thing and, and I would accept a season of that.

Yes, exactly. But that's not how I want my life to be forever. Mm-hmm. And so there was definitely times when I was in the wrong situation because my, I was no longer aligned with the organization's mission and I wasn't aligned with the way they wanted to work. And that was a. Sign for me a signal to make different decisions because if I wasn't going to, I wasn't gonna be able to change everyone's mind and change the mission of the organization.

Mm-hmm. So that means I needed to find a new place for myself. Yep. I think another really sneaky thing to look out for. To proactively like not end up in the situation that I did. Obviously I don't, you know, not that you're gonna get sick every time you get burnt out. Burn burnout can be chronic, right? It can be very subversive where you're not realizing it's even happening consciously.

Yeah. So I think another question to ask yourself and to gut check is, do you even know why you're doing the things you're doing day to day? Mm-hmm. For me, the way that I operate, I need to know why. And not everybody is like that, but. A lot of high performers, a lot of entrepreneurs that I have met, they're like, make it make sense.

And then I'll say Yes, right? Mm-hmm. And so it goes back to your, your point Candace earlier of like, why are you even doing this? Like, what is it for? What's the larger purpose? Mm-hmm. Because if you don't have a purpose, then what's the point? You're just wasting your time. No matter how many hours, you're just wasting more hours actually.

And there's no glory. There's no glory in that. Yeah, so ask yourself why. So, and just to recap a few of the things, Kat. Yeah. We're talking about if you're feeling like you have some emotional exhaustion. Mm-hmm. Maybe you're snapping at your loved ones, just a little. Just feel like you don't have time for the things that you normally care about if you are maybe not sleeping well.

Maybe sleeping a lot. Just abnormal sleep or like you can't fall asleep. Yeah, yeah. Any of those things. Yes. Mm-hmm. If you have creative, like a creative block, you feel like can't write anymore, you feel like you can't, you know, make videos anymore, you feel like you're just, you can't even pick up the phone.

You don't wanna talk to anyone, even to the people you're typically excited to talk to. Um, if there's any type of resentment that you're having towards the work that you typically like. Mm-hmm. Those are all signs that this might be burnout and you might want to get serious about being proactive in this moment so that you don't lead down a spiral.

Yeah. And there are things that you can do. Ahead of burnout when you begin to feel it. So that doesn't last as long. And a lot of times people don't wanna take some time off mm-hmm. Because they think they're gonna lose out. But like, ka, if you would've taken two, three days for yourself, that would've been better than the the 10 days that you lost.

The 10 days, because Yeah. Yeah. It's like being penny wise and pound foolish. Right, and, and two or three days of rest or cowra or just getting clear on what's bothering you, right? What's not feeling, what's feeling off Might have been the anecdote to this maybe. Yeah, it definitely would have at least given me enough space to reflect in the moment, which is so valuable rather than just saying, oh, well hindsight is 2020.

It's like, no, you can, you can pause, you can take five seconds. And to just breathe and check in with yourself, you know? But I get that, I've definitely done this before where like I didn't wanna le let people down, so I didn't convey that. Yeah. And then probably let them down more because I couldn't, you know, deliver, even though I said I was going to, or even though I, I just didn't communicate well and I wanna be better about that.

Yeah. And I think the. The kind of like thought that I'll, I'll leave the clever crew with is, and this was inspired by a client who I was talking with, we're working on like an article right now for her 25th anniversary, reveal and rebrand and all this. And she had said something where she said, how can you expect clients to believe you can protect their value, the value of their home, right?

She's a real estate broker if you can't even protect your own value as an individual. And I was like, Ooh, we're using that line in the article. And also. How can you expect somebody to trust that you can take care of them if you can't take care of yourself? Mm-hmm. And so start there. Start with N and you know, use the tips we mentioned here.

And the last one I'll use is also don't look at your phone the moment you wake up. Just take 15 minutes for yourself. That's huge. Yes, it is. That's probably the single most important thing I do. Every morning, like the most important part of my morning routine. I don't even look at it for an hour actually after I wake up.

That's incredible. I need to get on that because I look at it and then I stress out with all the things I have to do because everyone's sent me all the things that they need from me and I feel like I need to do it. And you're already like getting things in front of you. I feel like I'm behind 'cause it's not, yeah, it's not in my calendar.

Talk to my assistant, okay. To get him examine. Clever crew. We hope that this episode reminded you that we are all human, that we still at times are susceptible to burnout and imposter syndrome, adjust like you, and we hope you got a few tools that you can use so the next time you are feeling this way, you can help pull yourself out of that.

We're here for you. Thanks for joining us on. Not Nice clever. Remember to follow, not nice, clever, wherever you listen to audio. And if you haven't already, drop that five star review. Share your takeaways, tell us your story. We love to hear it. Signing off, you're not so nice, but so clever besties that mean business.

See you soon.